Out-of-work megayacht captains switching to commercial vessels...JUST GREAT!...

**c.captain** · February 10th, 2009, 06:27 AM

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</TD></TR><TR><TD>(PALM BEACH, Fla.) -- Some out-of-work yacht captains are attempting a career change into the commercial maritime industry, The Triton-Megayacht News reported. The slowing economy, which has hurt the yacht business, has convinced some captains to take courses for commercial jobs if conditions don't improve after the holidays. One captain already has been hired by Edison Chouest on a 280-foot supply vessel.

Click here to view the The Triton-Megayacht News story.

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I say BULLSHIT on this...us mariners who have been working on REAL vessels for years and facing decreasing employment opportunities in today's jobs market having to face another flood of people who DON'T HAVE A CLUE! Are they getting seatime for running some rich guy's playtoy?!? If they are, it is PLAIN WRONG AND HARMS US!

Yet another giveaway by the USCG to screw the real working American PROFESSIONAL Mariner!

Sorry to blowup like this but this one has lit the fuse this morning!

**Captainmugsy** · February 10th, 2009, 06:52 AM

We are supposed to get one of those new hire "Yacht Captains" on crew change Thursday. Only time will tell. Everyone will get the benefit of the doubt with me. There is one ex Yacht captain (lets call him Fred) with my company who knows everything about everything but don't know a damn thing. I won't hold that against this new guy. At least He an American.

hn · February 10th, 2009, 08:45 AM

I have agreed with most of your ranting about foreign workers, but now you are pissed about yacht captains. Get over it. I don't care if they are row boat captains. If a mariner has the paper then they can play. Competition is what it is so we all better make ourselves the best we can be if we want to beat the other guy out of a job.

**anchorman** · February 10th, 2009, 08:55 AM

Originally Posted by hn

I have agreed with most of your ranting about foreign workers, but now you are pissed about yacht captains. Get over it. I don't care if they are row boat captains. If a mariner has the paper then they can play. Competition is what it is so we all better make ourselves the best we can be if we want to beat the other guy out of a job.

The true colors are beginning to shine through the guise of red,white,and blue. My nose is usually spot on......and this seems to be one of those times.

**c.captain** · February 10th, 2009, 08:59 AM

How does working on a yacht for a bunch of years (most yacht guys have never worked on a commercial vessel) give experience for working on a tug or an offshore vessel?

I know that I rant alot but I do not believe that any yacht seatime should count towards getting a license. Even guys who go to yachts with licenses should not be allowed to upgrade them but with keeping them I'll relent.

If this is going to happen and these guys will get jobs on working vessels, then hopefully those who can will get to stay, but those who can't need to be shown the door very quickly. Not fair for a crew to deal with a yachtie's ways and inexperience. People get hurt and sometimes killed by fellow crewmembers making boneheaded stupid mistakes because they think they know when really they don't.

I think damned near every offshore mariner who has had to deal with a yacht guy sent to their vessel would agree.

**c.captain** · February 10th, 2009, 09:04 AM

hey anchorman

It's about protecting one's turf...

You've already made it abundently clear how much you want to protect your large OSV turf from unlimited tonnage mariners so I wouldn't be throwing too many stones here...

**Stareed** · February 10th, 2009, 09:14 AM

C.Captain,
Quit your crying! YOU must be incredibly insecure in you abilities to be so worried about an American who needs to go to work. If you are being the best you can, You should have nothing to worry about if the "Yachties" are as bad as you say! Give them a chance! They are out of work americans! End of story! AMERICA FIRST!!

**anchorman** · February 10th, 2009, 09:37 AM

Originally Posted by c.captain

hey anchorman

It's about protecting one's turf...

You've already made it abundently clear how much you want to protect your large OSV turf from unlimited tonnage mariners so I wouldn't be throwing too many stones here...

Um, I am an unlimited tonnage mariner and don't believe protecting anything from myself would make much sense, but I will, and continue to advocate a career path for those mariners who work on a similar vessels to the one that they've been working on for the previous 5 years with the only difference being 10 more tons on the COI.

**c.captain** · February 10th, 2009, 10:08 AM

For all of you sticking up for yacht mariners it is your right to and I give you no argument with that. You can have your opinion and I can habe mine. Regardless that they are Americans, they often are a danger to their shipmates. Those I sail with here have their experiences with yacht guys and they are not positive ones. As said, if they can then they should but if they can't then out with them asap. Wouldn't you rather not have to deal with that process and just have a man who has been on your kind of boat for years? I sure as hell would.

My biggest beef is that they get seatime for a license to sail on other than yachts. A guy with an OSV restricted license is stuck on OSV's so why should a guy who has run yachts not be restricted? How much seatime do these guys get towards licenses which aren't restricted since there is no such thing as a "yacht" license? Realize that I am sticking up for YOU and me here.

**Robert** · February 10th, 2009, 10:34 AM

Originally Posted by c.captain

Regardless that they are Americans, they often are a danger to their shipmates.

I wonder if we look at all the commercial maritime casualties how many would be former Yacht Captains. I don't know the answer, but I bet it is not many.

**c.captain** · February 10th, 2009, 11:09 AM

That statistic would be dependant of how many yacht masters and mates make the switch to commercial vessels. I really do not think the number is that many.

I have been going to sea for 25 years and have only once encountered an ex yacht master as a mate recently on a commercial vessel. I think this is because for the last 25years the yacht business has been booming and frankly I believe most will tell you that they are a very tight bunch who do not take to outsiders trying to get in their club and that the jobs on the very large yachts have been actually paying very well. That one guy I worked with told me $175k for a master of a 200' megayacht was not uncommon but you had to be the manager as well as the master. All told he said it was a great gig and the competition for those jobs was fierce inside their club with a lot of backstabbing as a result. I can't recall why this guy was still not on them, but I also recall that the master of the vessel we were both on wouldn't let him move it in Fourchon even though he was 2nd captain there.

I do know that on the small passenger vessels which are run by companies like CruiseWest often hire yacht people, but if you know anything at all about CruiseWest you will know that they can't go a year with a vessel going aground and tearing out its bottom! Need I say more?

**Capt_Anonymous** · February 10th, 2009, 12:55 PM

One of the nice things about holding an inspected license is you have the ability to move in different sectors of the maritime world. No one forces a guy to get an OSV license, it just comes quicker so guys get them. Then they're stuck on OSVs. Their choice. I don't care what some guy's background is when he comes to my boat, the thing I care about is whether or not I can sleep when he is on watch. If he has the aptitude and courage to enter a brand new world, more power to him. If he tries and fails, too bad. But to generalize a group of guys because they happened to start out on yachts is unfair. In my mind I'm more conerned about what they're capable of, rather than where they've been.

**c.captain** · February 10th, 2009, 01:26 PM

This is more about seatime than ability...should a person get seatime towards an unrestricted license if he had no experience other than yachts? I think a yacht engineer would have more crossover experience than a mate or master.

Yes, some I am sure are natural seamen and capable mariners in the yacht community but what percentage? To allow each of them to earn the same licenses as a man who has worked on workboats (& btw, my career is 75% workboats and 25% ships) his whole career...well as Dave Letterman says "something just doesn't smell right here"

Ok, I am going to quit arguing this one because now it is just becoming repetitive. If you all want the yacht guys with you fine but remember the greater the number of licenses out there the better chance there will be a surplus of them and history bears me out when I say that anytime there is a surplus, the companies use that as an excuse to drive wages down by going for the lowest bidder for any job. Why hire the experienced pro, when I can have this guy for half, even if he has never done the job before? Should we just trust the companies to protect the positions of the most experienced mariner? Maybe some will but....!

I'm out...

**tengineer** · February 10th, 2009, 01:31 PM

"But to generalize a group of guys because they happened to start out on yachts is unfair."

True, it'd be like generalizing about guys that started out on Navy ships or shrimp boats or bass boats or air boats or pickup trucks or whatever.
A wise man once said 'all generalizations are wrong, including this one.'

**Robert** · February 10th, 2009, 01:55 PM

Originally Posted by tengineer

"But to generalize a group of guys because they happened to start out on yachts is unfair."

True, it'd be like generalizing about guys that started out on Navy ships or shrimp boats or bass boats or air boats or pickup trucks or whatever.
A wise man once said 'all generalizations are wrong, including this one.'

Exactly tengineer. I think that is why many were pushing back on the original post.

**water** · February 10th, 2009, 05:13 PM

Originally Posted by tengineer

"But to generalize a group of guys because they happened to start out on yachts is unfair."

True, it'd be like generalizing about guys that started out on Navy ships or shrimp boats or bass boats or air boats or pickup trucks or whatever.
A wise man once said 'all generalizations are wrong, including this one.'

AMEN.... Couldn't agree more.

**Captainmugsy** · February 10th, 2009, 09:53 PM

I didn't know this industry (GOM) even existied before I came from down with the help of a head hunter in 95. I spent 11 years in the Navy Before this and there was always someone there to show me how to do it the Oil Patch way, (not always with a smile but still) what's next don't let the Navy guys in because they are a hazard to your crew. Everyone has to be taught or show'n the way. Did you know it all when you came to work down here? or were you a know it all?

**intheweeds** · February 10th, 2009, 10:58 PM

Years ago as a green deckhand working on a fish processing ship, I was trained by a young mate and a great old captain on how real commercial sailors worked, I took that advice and absorbed as much learning as I could and became an AB. I later worked on tankers, ro/ro's and other commercial ships and went from AB to 3rd Mate to 2nd mate to a 1600 ton master. All this time learning from mates and captains who worked in all parts of the industry. I eventually spent some time on some passenger vessel and on occasion, on some yachts. There I met professional mariners who were looking for a change and newbies who wanted desperately to break into working on the water, even if it meant serving some rich guy his dinner on a yacht. The thought of working on the water and moving on to bigger and better things drove these folks and they worked harder than any other sailors I have ever sailed with. Some had old experienced captains that guided them and showed them the path to the commercial side. I spent spent hundreds of hours on navigational watches with these young/green folks, showing them how to stand a safe watch and telling them stories of what watches will be like once they become AB's or mates. I sincerely hope all my brother and sister mariners out there will extend the same courtesy and guidance to a new mariner showing up on there ship, whether they came from a yacht, a tug, a research vessel, a tanker, or any other type of craft. We want our industry to be strong and training new mariners is another way to keep it strong.

**tengineer** · February 10th, 2009, 11:05 PM

Geez Mugsy, don't get your drawers all in a wad over being ex Navy. Lord, some of the best I've run across were ex Navy [I almost said squids]. My comment was a "for instance" sort of thing. Hell, I drove a farm tractor and destroyed a lot of machinery before I went to sea and when I went it was as a private being driven around on ships by squids [yeah I said it]. So if anyone should never have succeeded in a merchant marine career, especially as an engineer, I qualify.
Everbody deserves a chance is all I was saying.
Cool?

**intheweeds** · February 10th, 2009, 11:15 PM

Amen to that tengineer. I was milking cows before the USMC put a rifle in my hand and had squids hauling my ass all over the world. Never in a million years would I have thought I would ever be driving a ship. What a great country this is and what a great industry to have these opportunities!