SV Concordia sinks off Brasil

[richard8000milesaway]

http://www.classafloat.com/Default.aspx?tabid=113
and
http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2010...html?ref=world

in the words of Homer Simpson, "Du-OH!"

glad no one was hurt though!!!

a shame: she was a really beautiful vessel, I used to see her regularly in New England waters......

[CaptAndrew]

This is currently the talk of the Tallship world. Thanks for posting before I did. I just logged in mostly for that purpose. My cook served on her last year, and knows most of the crew and several of the students. He is naturally waiting for more info.

[kzoo pilot]

I was really rocked on my heels when I heard about the sinking Friday morning. She was on the Lakes eight years ago and I was her pilot for her time on Huron and Michigan . . . great ship and crew. When I checked the school's website about the incident I also found out the gentleman who sailed as Master when she was here passed away last fall. Double whammy for me.

Glad to hear the crew and students are ok.

[rjbpilot]

I remember her also.....I wonder what the circumstances were. It will be interesting to find out more. A shame.

[steelbeach]

Another interesting case study for classes.
Especially sensitive when you consider the passengers were young students.
Article I read mentioned the IPIRB deployed and yet they were in the raft for thirty hours before a merchantman rescued them.
That she went down in such a short time and nobody was lost seems to shine a good light on the crew skills.

[kzoo pilot]

AP report states that two rafts fouled in the rigging on the way down . . . luckily Cookie came out of the galley (which is just fwd of the waist on the main deck) with a knife and was able to cut them free. The pics of the kids coming down the brow of the corvette that brought them in showed lots of shorts, t's, and flip flops.

A sailor without a knife . . .

I have to keep telling myself that the students are not professional sailors but a bunch of (very fortunate) kids. I am very interested in the incident report. The paid crew several years where really sharp and I am willing to bet there are some great lessons to be learned from the whole affair. I am just glad everyone is ok.

[richard8000milesaway]

not sure of where exactly the vessel ran into trouble, but from various sources I see her due south of Cabo Frio, that bold point of land at around 23 degrees south latitude due east of Rio. The point is a famous convergence point of north going cold water and south going warm water. I spent some time in that area in 1989 & 2009 and found the ocean weather to be unpredictible: the tropical weather always seemed to be fighting with the temperate southern weather. seas were not great either: the above mentioned currents as well as an occassional monster swell from the deep south.

[Jeffrox]

The article I read reported the vessel encountered a microbust that knocked her down twice quickly, then she stayed down and sunk fast.

[Bordertrade]

How does a Coast Guard Certified vessel sink in 30 min.... simple nobody dogged the watertight doors while at sea...human error

[Steamer]

How does a Coast Guard Certified vessel sink in 30 min.... simple nobody dogged the watertight doors while at sea...human error

Which watertight doors do you have in mind?

And what certification are you talking about? The boat was Barbados flagged and surveyed to Lloyds standards for a yacht. It was not carrying passengers and it met all the standards it was required to meet.

Whether those standards are what the "crew" and their parents thought they were is another question.

It rolled over and sank like ships of that design tend to do when knocked down.

[Bordertrade]

ummm yes it was carrying passengers... they are called the students whose parents were paying a huge fee to put them there..as for the certification I believe i read somewhere online that it was a CG certified Vessel, if this was true all the vessels I have delt with that are CG cert. have watertight bukheads throughout the hull, porthole covers, and 6 dog doors on the cabins..I think they had very good emergency training for a "what if" scenario, but a ship this modern with such a skilled crew should never of floundered..

[marcelmuise]

I believe i read somewhere online that it was a CG certified Vessel, if this was true all the vessels I have delt with that are CG cert. have watertight bukheads throughout the hull, porthole covers, and 6 dog doors on the cabins..

That probably means she had a Certificate of Compliance at one time after a port state control boarding or control verification exam. I forget the rules for loadlines on passenger vessels, but I don't think she would have to have that cert. Even for U.S. vessels, the regs for School Ships and Sailing School Vessels (SSV) are different than for Passenger Vessels. See Subchapter R (instead of H, K, ot T).

[seadog!]

"floundered.."?, maybe, but

foundered fits better.

[mslilith2000]

Which watertight doors do you have in mind?

And what certification are you talking about? The boat was Barbados flagged and surveyed to Lloyds standards for a yacht. It was not carrying passengers and it met all the standards it was required to meet.

Whether those standards are what the "crew" and their parents thought they were is another question.

It rolled over and sank like ships of that design tend to do when knocked down.

I'm in complete agreement with Steamer here.

Bordertrade, the keel was laid in Poland; the vessel registered in Barbados; and she worked out of Canada. For a Canadian educational institute. There would be no reason for the USCG to be involved with the Concordia. Are you talking about the Canadian equivalent to the USCG?

I've toured some very large sailboats but have never seen watertight doors on any of them. These were privately owned vessels - would that make a difference? I've seen hot tubs, bodacious bars, and grand pianos but no watertight doors. Anyone seen a big a$$ sailboat with watertight doors? Inquiring minds want to know...

[mslilith2000]

For any other inquiring minds, I found this quick spec sheet for the Concordia.

http://www.classafloat.com/THEJOURNE...5/Default.aspx

It's so sad when one of these gracious vessels is lost. Glad everyone on board was ok - the Captain said it was a bit of luck and a darn fine crew that made the difference.

[richard8000milesaway]

"Anyone seen a big a$$ sailboat with watertight doors?"

sure, plenty. crewed on all of them: Corwith Cramer, Windward, Sea Cloud. all 3 are steel hulled sailing ships and very well designed with regard to safety as well as sailing properties.

[richardharris97]

I'm in complete agreement with Steamer here.

Bordertrade, the keel was laid in Poland; the vessel registered in Barbados; and she worked out of Canada. For a Canadian educational institute. There would be no reason for the USCG to be involved with the Concordia. Are you talking about the Canadian equivalent to the USCG?

I've toured some very large sailboats but have never seen watertight doors on any of them. These were privately owned vessels - would that make a difference? I've seen hot tubs, bodacious bars, and grand pianos but no watertight doors. Anyone seen a big a$$ sailboat with watertight doors? Inquiring minds want to know...

I sailed as Mate on Concordia for 3 months leaving in Oct 2009.
On the weather deck she has dogged aluminium doors, below she has hand pumped WT door dividing the vessel into small compartments. As she lay over at 90 degrees no one could have returned below to close the WT doors. She comes under the MCA mega yacht code for sail training vessels. She is stable at 90 degrees, but as the 'micro burst' held her over she would have down flooded thru' the vents & that would eventualy (15 minutes) cause her to sink. Capt. Bill Curry held frequent abandon ship drills, which is how the students & crew successfully launched & boarded the rafts without loss. Flip flops are not allowed at sea. That was loaned clothing as the students clothing was lost in the sinking. The students sail the vessel & carry out all normal crew jobs in addition to their acedemic studiesstudies. Previously Concordia has sailed world wide including rounding the Horn. 5 years ago I sailed on her in the N & S Pacific.

[BSCPaul]

richardharris97, thanks for likely description of events. I think it is remarkable that all managed to successfully escape. I read somewhere that the skipper had to dive in to cut a raft(s) free, which given all the rigging seems very plausible to me.

The fact that all were able to abandon ship with such speed suggests to me that the drills were serious efforts by all concerned. Its one thing to practice the drills under ideal conditions, it is quite another to perform the real thing when the ship is on her side.

[richard8000milesaway]

I agree, good training all around saved lives. of course, seeing a scared 23 year old blond haired cutie wearing a bikini top sitting in a liferaft would have me overboard to play Lancelot in about 1 second flat.
Lucky Brasilian offcers got there first.

[Mac Mackay]

Barbados has become a flag of convenience for Canada as a tax avoidance measure. That Canadian taxpayers should now be expected to foot the bill for an expensive Transportation Safety Board investigation is a sad commentary.
Yes the TSB will do a good job, will find out what happened, and in a year or two and will submit a splendidly detailed report. TSB has no authority to enforce rules or make new ones, or to attach responsibility. Their report will be ignored by Transport Canada and certainly by Barbados.
What is the point?